Francis Fukuyama on Trump, China and the Legacy of 9/11

September 11, 2026

Guests: Francis Fukuyama

Francis Fukuyama is a political scientist at Stanford University and the author of 'The End of History and the Last Man'; his later work includes a two-volume history of political order, a critique of the neoconservative movement he once belonged to, and the new memoir 'In the Realm of the Last Man.'

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About this episode

Was Francis Fukuyama right all along? Klein revisits 'The End of History and the Last Man' on the 25th anniversary of 9/11, arguing it was misread as triumphalist when it warned liberalism rests on a thin view of human nature. Fukuyama explains his Hegelian framework: liberal democracy survives only if it distributes recognition, not just prosperity. He distinguishes isothymia (equal dignity) from megalothymia (the desire to be seen as superior), which Trump embodies by seeking political power beyond wealth. The 9/11 attacks did not threaten liberalism; the overreaction — Afghanistan, Iraq, the surveillance state — bred the cynicism that produced Trump. Fukuyama faults Obama for lacking ambition amid American 'vetocracy,' and calls Trump a 'repatrimonializing' force rewarding friends and family. China is the only plausible rival model — a competent state without rule of law or elections — but its sustainability is uncertain, while AI and social media threaten democracy.

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